Ys Utopia.net

Localization Projects => NEC PC Engine/Turbo Duo CD-ROM² Console => Ys IV: The Dawn of Ys => Topic started by: Europrick on Jan. 23, 2006, 02:10:48 PM

Title: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: Europrick on Jan. 23, 2006, 02:10:48 PM
Thought I'd try to get some discussion going here. So, let us discuss which version of Ys IV that is the best one. Come on now. :rolleyes:

Edit: Since it was possible to vote again now, I have reset the poll. So vote again folks!  ;)
Title: RE: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: Arjak on Jan. 23, 2006, 02:39:48 PM
This is a joke topic, isn't it, Seldane?:P
Title: RE: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: rEd2k on Jan. 23, 2006, 09:07:21 PM
I don't think this is a joke, I loved the TG16 version. But what the hell?!!! I didn't even know there is a PS2 version!!!!!! (been outta date for awhile)..
Title: RE: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: NightWolve on Jan. 23, 2006, 11:22:35 PM
"Ys IV: The Dawn of Ys" hands down. I once tried playing the crappy patch Shimarisu did for the SNES version and it is just simply terrible. TERRIBLE!!!! Maybe it is a decent game, but you certainly won't be able to tell until that translation patch is entirely revamped, which incidentally, I hear Ghideon Zhi does plan on doing some time in the future.

I never finished the game I started btw; I couldn't manage to force myself to finish it off. I tried again a while back, but it had been so long that I put off continuing, I got stuck and didn't know what to do next. Course, I didn't feel like starting over, so that was that...
Title: RE: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: Europrick on Jan. 24, 2006, 07:52:43 AM
Personally, I'm a little unsure about this.

When I played Ys IV years ago, I loved it. Loved it. I played through it almost instantly.

When I first played Ys IV The Dawn of Ys, I did like it a little, but got sick of it pretty fast. I stopped playing it entirely when I got stuck at one point. I tried to pick it up a couple of times but never really got into it since I didn't remember what had happened in the game (just like your Mask of the Sun story).

When your English patch came out, I started playing the game more seriously. This time I really enjoyed the game, but when I had finished about 2/3 of the game, Magic Engine decided to corrupt my whole SRAM data. I didn't feel like starting over so soon, so I dropped it.

After maybe six months, I started over again. This time I really enjoyed the game, and I got past the point where my previous save file got corrupted. I got to the very end of the game and got stuck there, and dropped it.

Then I got a PC Engine DUO-R and the first thing I did was to start Ys IV. I played it quite a lot, but then decided to RGB mod it. About halfway through the mod I realized that I didn't have enough information about how to actually get the signal to my TV, so I dropped it. I fired up my Duo and accidentally got into the save menu and even more accidentally managed to format the SRAM. The menus are in Japanese, that's why.

That didn't discourage me that much, and after some SCART research, I performed the RGB mod beautifully. With RGB signal everything looks so good, so I'm playing The Dawn of Ys again. I love the game.

But I borrowed my friend's SNES a couple of days ago. I put in my Ys IV cartridge and played that. Such a great game! I'm very puzzled. Which one's the best? I really can't tell. Both of them are fantastic.

Oh, right -- the PS2 version. Well, I bought that one as soon as it was released, and to be honest -- I actually enjoyed it quite a lot. In the beginning. Then I got to the ice dungeon and that just made me sick. The game's awful! But I still like it .... for some strange reason.

Boy, this turned out to be a rather lengthy post. Mostly blabbering too. Hehe.

Anyway - my point is: I can't decide which one that's the best. I love 'em all and I always will.
Title: RE: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: Gillian Seed on Jan. 27, 2006, 06:16:49 PM
The PCE version is obviously the best, but my favorite version is the SNES one.
Title: RE: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: Platypus on Jan. 28, 2006, 04:24:16 AM
I second Gillians comment. Technically Dawn of Ys is a bit better, but I still voted for Mask of the Sun because of the story and gameplay.
Title: RE:  Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: rocket on Jan. 30, 2006, 10:18:30 AM
Quote from: NightWolve

"Ys IV: The Dawn of Ys" hands down. I once tried playing the crappy patch Shimarisu did for the SNES version and it is just simply terrible. TERRIBLE!!!! Maybe it is a decent game, but you certainly won't be able to tell until that translation patch is entirely revamped, which incidentally, I hear Ghideon Zhi does plan on doing some time in the future.

I never finished the game I started btw; I couldn't manage to force myself to finish it off. I tried again a while back, but it had been so long that I put off continuing, I got stuck and didn't know what to do next. Course, I didn't feel like starting over, so that was that...


Not quite sure if it was the translation or just the fact that mask of the sun sucked in comparison to dawn of ys. I made it half way through mask of the sun and quit also.
Title: RE: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: ViperD on Feb. 02, 2006, 03:53:32 AM
Soon everyone can pick a new version of Mask of the Sun - A New Theory for your phone...
Title: RE: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: duke4711 on Feb. 03, 2006, 10:13:57 PM
I'd have to say Dawn of Ys, myself. I had been wanting to play it ever since it's release, but never bothered because I know all of two words in Japanese. When Nightwolve's translation came out, I flew right through it. I then applied the patch to the SNES rom of Mask of the Sun, thinking I'd fly through that one too, but I lost interest in it pretty quickly. Not sure why, though. I've even started playing it since then and still lost interest after a while. So for this reason I say Dawn of Ys is better.
Title: I can't give a fair answer...
Post by: TDOMMX on Feb. 12, 2006, 03:38:37 PM
I just finished Mask of the Sun a few days ago.  I've fiddled with The Dawn of Ys previously, but I didn't start playing through it since it wasn't 100% in English at the time.

I'm inclined to say that Dawn is better, but I can't give a fair comparison until I play through the game.  The translation of Mask was so-so, but the insertion job was absolutely horrible.  I've done better insertion jobs than that.  Well, if a revised version of the patch is coming out, great, but I don't see any reason to snatch it up the moment it comes out...

On that note, does anyone know how Justus' dub patch for Dawn is working out?  That's the only thing that is preventing me from playing through Dawn.  If I remember correctly, he said that he would be doing a group dub session over the holidays, but I haven't heard anything about it since...

While I tend to prefer Japanese voice acting to dubs, I'm not hardcore enough to pause a game every few minutes to look at a translated script.  However, I'll make a point of playing through the entire game once the dub is ready, regardless of how professional or campy it may be.
Title: RE: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: NightWolve on Feb. 12, 2006, 04:35:38 PM
Really, I wouldn't wait for the dubs. I have no idea what Justus is doing now. He was around not too recently and showed us his dubbing work for Radiant Silvergun, but now I dunno.

You're missing out on a fine game for something that may never happen. I'd go ahead and play it. In fact, I'm gonna release a patch update for the script that I was holding off on cause I wanted to wait till the dubs came along. I've decided not to hold off any longer. Expect version .96 very soon, which will change spellings such as "Romn" back to "Romun." It's just spelling corrections and I'll probably redesign the ReadMe. Would be fun to maybe make a new patcher, but I doubt I'll fit that in this time.
Title: RE: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: Europrick on Feb. 13, 2006, 06:22:32 AM
I agree with NightWolve. Waiting for the dub seems futile. The game doesn't contain that much spoken dialogue and reading the script when the speech is over isn't a problem (but beware -- I accidentally read one more sentence at one point and that spoiled a major part of the game for me!).

The Dawn of Ys is awesome. But I don't feel like playing through it because my SRAM got reset again :P (I was fiddling inside the console and I guess there was some power left in it so it probably got shorted).
Title: Re: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: Europrick on Feb. 18, 2006, 07:19:48 PM
Please cast your vote once more. I have reset the poll because it was possible to vote again now that the board software has been changed. It would be wrong to vote twice.  ;)
Title: Re: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: NightWolve on Feb. 18, 2006, 07:28:11 PM
Oy vey... You didn't have to do that... It wasn't that important to clear out the data. I just didn't bother to figure out how to import the markers that store who voted exactly for what cause, yeah, it wasn't gonna be an issue, really, and it was just one poll... Heh. Geez, dude, you pest.

EDIT: Alright, I fixed it. Happy? Good. Every member ID that already voted was marked and I restored the counted values... "Save the poll! Must save the poll! Alright alright!"
Title: Re: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: Agent_K64 on Feb. 18, 2006, 07:52:07 PM
*cough*
I haven't played any of those. :p
*runs*
Title: Re: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: JoeQuaker on Feb. 21, 2006, 04:49:51 PM
I haven't got to play it yet either, but I'll vote PC-Engine because thus far those have been my fav Y's versions.

One small exception...

Y's III... that's what I'm on when I fire up my TurboDuo on occasion. I've only completed book 1 and 2 thus far. And as much as I hate most SNES versions... the intro to 3 was much better on SNES I though. Cool graphics, and that cool strange SNES fanfare music... and the weird techno sounding tune that plays as the wolf thing is being slain. All of that aside though, I still like the PC-Engine version best even with the crazy scrolling backgrounds... at a loss as to why.
Title: Re: RE: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: esteban666 on Feb. 21, 2006, 07:19:28 PM
Then I got a PC Engine DUO-R and the first thing I did was to start Ys IV. I played it quite a lot, but then decided to RGB mod it. About halfway through the mod I realized that I didn't have enough information about how to actually get the signal to my TV, so I dropped it. I fired up my Duo and accidentally got into the save menu and even more accidentally managed to format the SRAM. The menus are in Japanese, that's why.
This was painful to read! I'm sure you have a Tennokoe Bank now, but you have had some seriously bad luck -- losing one game save is so frustrating, I can't imagine losing multiple saves. Insane!
Title: Re: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: Europrick on Feb. 21, 2006, 07:30:48 PM
Hehehe, believe it or not, but when I had finished the RGB amp just a few days ago (made one to yet enhance the video quality) -- the SRAM was once again corrupt. I had to re-format it. Ha ha ha! This is the third time! Started over a few days ago. Not too excited to play it any more though. ;)

But now I'm 100% finished with the modding*, so I don't think this will happen again. The PCE appears to be really sensitive -- tampering inside the console has corrupted the SRAM for me every time! Fortunately I haven't played on it that much so I haven't lost anything important yet. :)

*Still considering making a Jap/US Hu-card switch and replacing the red LED with a blue one though. We'll see what happens. ;)
Title: Re: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: Paranoia Dragon on Feb. 28, 2006, 04:59:46 AM
Deffinitly DOY!  I've played thru both, though, I've only played thru DOY in Japanese, & I played thru MOTS in english.  Even so, I like the story better in DOY.  Without spoiling anything for anyone that hasn't played MOTS, there's just some story elements that annoyed me.  Plus, the gameplay stinks in it, I hate the sword/magic system n' all.  That's not to say I hate the game(though the final districts in the game make me want to hate it).  It's just my least favorite Ys ever.  The PS2 version, in some ways, had some improvements, but, it's overall pretty sad.  Sheesh, I hope Ys 5 for PS2 doesn't end up stinking!
Title: Re: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: Haven on Mar. 04, 2006, 11:41:14 AM
Quite a shame that Dawn of Ys is sorta in an alternate timeline but for me it has the best (and I mean THE BEST) artwork in the series and it has a soundtrack that rivals even Oath of Felghana (especially that rocking Tower of Shadow and Death remix that should be in DeuceBag's alternate soundtrack) ^^

Even more of a shame was the fan dub project was scrapped. Either Nightwolve comes up with a way to add subtitles, or a miracle would happen and the fan dub project get's revived. T_T

If Falcom (and I do mean Falcom) is ever gonna remake Ys IV, I hope they grab the same character designer for Dawn of Ys , use voice acting (they're the dudes who voiced in the 80s Gundam shows I think), and probably improve the music if possible (and possibly Oath of Felghana quality).
Title: Re: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: Boog on Mar. 09, 2006, 07:51:46 PM
I have Ys IV: Dawn of Ys with the english patch that is on a CD-R disc and my region free Super CD-rom II attachment that is hooked up to my Core Grafx/PC Engine and I played and almost beat it but it stopped working because the CD-R disc wasn't completely copied. :(

My Super CD-rom II attachment plays copied TG-16, PCE and Duo games. 8)
Title: Re: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: Europrick on Mar. 10, 2006, 08:42:43 AM
I have Ys IV: Dawn of Ys with the english patch that is on a CD-R disc and my region free Super CD-rom II attachment that is hooked up to my Core Grafx/PC Engine and I played and almost beat it but it stopped working because the CD-R disc wasn't completely copied. :(

My Super CD-rom II attachment plays copied TG-16, PCE and Duo games. 8)

Your console isn't region-free. The PCE/TG CD no region protection in the first place.

Most PCE/TG CD consoles will play CD-R discs, but it kind of depends on the laser. It is possible to modify a laser unit that won't read CD-R discs so that it will.
Title: Re: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: turbofan on Mar. 10, 2006, 09:59:38 AM

Alright than,how do you about modifyin the laser unit?
Title: Re: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: Europrick on Mar. 10, 2006, 11:21:12 AM

Alright than,how do you about modifyin the laser unit?

Fairly complicated. I'm not going to explain that in an Ys IV thread. ;)
Title: Re: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: Gamemusicfreak on Mar. 12, 2006, 08:21:11 AM
Played and finished all three Ys IVs.  The Dawn of Ys will always be my favorite. 
Title: Re: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: Red Hairdo on Mar. 14, 2006, 04:05:56 PM
 Since I didn't finish Dawn of Ys YET and since I never got my hands into Mask of the Sun for PS2, I won't vote know.

 But I wanted to say: It seems there is another version of Ys IV (still Mask of the Sun) for a game console knew as 'Mobile'... from what I heard, Mobile is a cel. phone that has games for it. You can check it out on GameFAQs ===>http://www.gamefaqs.com/portable/mobile/data/930128.html
Title: Re: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: Europrick on Mar. 14, 2006, 04:11:01 PM
Since I didn't finish Dawn of Ys YET and since I never got my hands into Mask of the Sun for PS2, I won't vote know.

 But I wanted to say: It seems there is another version of Ys IV (still Mask of the Sun) for a game console knew as 'Mobile'... from what I heard, Mobile is a cel. phone that has games for it. You can check it out on GameFAQs ===>http://www.gamefaqs.com/portable/mobile/data/930128.html

Hehehe. It's not known as "mobile." Mobile is the platform. As in -- the game's on a mobile phone.

It will not be in this poll because nobody here will ever be able to play it. You can see some screenshots of it here (http://www.taito.co.jp/mobile/ew_docomo/falcom/game.html).

Ys VI, Ys ETERNAL and YsF has been released for mobile phones as well. Along with millions of other Ys mobile releases.
Title: Re: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: Red Hairdo on Mar. 14, 2006, 04:54:26 PM
Hehehe. It's not known as "mobile." Mobile is the platform. As in -- the game's on a mobile phone.

It will not be in this poll because nobody here will ever be able to play it. You can see some screenshots of it here (http://www.taito.co.jp/mobile/ew_docomo/falcom/game.html).

Ys VI, Ys ETERNAL and YsF has been released for mobile phones as well. Along with millions of other Ys mobile releases.

 Heheh, I guess you are right. Afterall the game doesn't look "great", so I think no one would vote for this Ys IV. (Also thanks for giving me that link)
Title: Re: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: Haven on Mar. 15, 2006, 09:26:29 AM
Good lord why even make 3D graphics with that thing!!!?
Title: Re: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: Europrick on Mar. 15, 2006, 09:40:46 AM
Imagine the framerate on those games!  :rolleyes: Playing Xanadu Next on an N-Gage was terrible, and it is a lot more powerful than those phones!

YsIV Mask of the Sun - A New Theory is hell on a PS2. I can't even imagine the agony of playing it on a cellphone.
Title: Re: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: Gamemusicfreak on Mar. 15, 2006, 09:13:08 PM
I can't imagine playing anything on a cellpone, I think the only game I could stand would be Tetris.
Title: Re: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: Game_Hunter on Mar. 18, 2006, 07:50:41 AM
I think Dawn of Ys is by far the best game, but I can't help wonder how the Mega-CD version of Mask of the Sun would have turned out if "Segafalcom" had finished it.  Their only game on the M-CD was the magnificent Popful Mail so I know that they could have achieved great things with Ys IV, imagine Popful's animation technique used for Mask of the Sun...  The only other games they produced where Dragon Slayer I&II and Lord Monarch on the MD, they should have been CD  >:(  Was there ever ANYTHING shown for the M-CD version or was it canceled so early that nothing was ever prgrammed?  I guess if Falcom decide to continue with the Ys remakes, it will be MotS that they remake which is a shame, maybe Hudson will make re-make DoYs one day though (they own it, correct?).  Then again, after their remakes of the Tengai Makyo games, I think i'd rather them not  :rolleyes:
Title: Re: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: Europrick on Mar. 18, 2006, 10:05:38 AM
Ys IV Mask of the Sun for Mega-CD was supposedly Falcom's "lost" scenario (the one they originally worked on themselves). Mask of the Sun for the SFC is not entirely Falcom's own game. Tokyo Shoseki bought it from Falcom and finished the development themselves. Falcom and Hudson made the PCE game together.

Sega Falcom were also working on another Mega-CD title -- Super Brandish. This was canned as well. Supposedly, there was no progress made on either Ys IV nor Super Brandish though.

I have a theory regarding the original Ys IV, but I will need to research it some more before I post it.
Title: Re: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: Game_Hunter on Mar. 18, 2006, 11:44:01 PM
Oh yea I forgot about Super Brandish, I dont know why they didn't make Ys IV and Super Brandish for the Saturn instead. Now THAT would have been good!   Maybe if they do ever get around to a remake of IV it will be what they intended Ys IV to be in the first place.  After the incredible Oath in Felghana I dont think anyone would really protest another remake of that quality, at least I know I wouldn't.
Title: Re: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: Europrick on Mar. 19, 2006, 07:43:07 AM
Been rumors about an Ys IV remake from Falcom. Will probably be their original scenario.

Falcom will release a new PC game this year. A new Ys game. I am sure it will be a remake of Ys IV.
Title: Re: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: Gamemusicfreak on Mar. 23, 2006, 01:46:46 AM
I was wondering if they did remake Ys IV, would they just take the numeration out like they did with Oath in Felghana?  Or would they also change the title like Oath as well?  When we first heard the title Oath in Felghana we all knew it had something to do with Ys III.
Now I'm curious if a new Ys game would have some sort of "keyword" that would tip us off to it being another Ys IV remake or not.  Selceta, perhaps?       
Title: Re: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: Europrick on Mar. 23, 2006, 10:25:26 AM
Could be Celceta the Sea of Trees, that is the title of Adol's diary about this particular adventure (YsIV Mask of the Sun).
Title: Re: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: Haven on Mar. 23, 2006, 09:17:15 PM
Whatever the future of Ys is, I hope:

> If they're gonna use English, use it right

> Don't release garbage OSTs like the YsF Super Arrange

> The reputation on the music set by Oath of Felghana would be retained (especially because the Dawn of Ys OST is my most favorite of all the Ys OSTs)

BTW

Don't you think they should call the Ys games from now on "Wanderers from Ys" since the Ys story arc was finished on the first two games and ended up becoming mere references?

Like you know

> Wanderers from Ys: Oath of Felghana
> Wanderers from Ys: The Mask of the Sun
> Wanderers from Ys: Ark of Napishtim

etc etc....

If I'd know better, the Ys IV remake would simply be called "The Dawn of Ys"
Title: Re: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: Europrick on Mar. 24, 2006, 04:28:27 AM
Why would it be called "The Dawn of Ys"? It is not going to be a "The Dawn of Ys" remake. It will be a Mask of the Sun remake.
Title: Re: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: Haven on Mar. 24, 2006, 02:47:58 PM
Why would it be called "The Dawn of Ys"? It is not going to be a "The Dawn of Ys" remake. It will be a Mask of the Sun remake.

That's called the "Misleading Title" trick

Hopefully the Ys IV remake would be the definitive part IV of the story

But I think they should add "Wanderers of" to the title^^
Title: Re: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: ranzor on Jun. 01, 2006, 06:07:08 AM
You got some crazy ideas, Haven.  :) But you're right, Ys isn't a very suitable name to the series other than I and II. I played Mask of the Sun for SNES and I'm playing Dawn of Ys now, and I have to say DoY is MUCH better. It's been a while since I played MotS and I don't remember all of the story so well, but the story in DoY is great. I couldn't help myself and after a while I read the whole script and I really like the way they conected everything to the story of I and II. And the whole thing about reviving that guy works better for me than the story in MotS. Anyway, I'm voting for it. I haven't played the PS2 version, but everywhere I read about it says that it's pretty crappy. I really hope Falcom remakes it for the PC (and Ys V too!)

p.s. The translation for Dawn of Ys is great, NightWolve! A shame you couldn't fit in some subtitles, then it would be perfect.
Title: Re: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: Europrick on Jun. 01, 2006, 08:13:49 AM
Ranzor: What happens in DoY doesn't really "happen" -- i.e. Dark Fact is never resurrected, Sara never comes back to life, etc. It's all Hudson's own story and isn't part of the real Ys timeline.
Title: Re: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: xneoangel on Jun. 01, 2006, 08:29:11 AM
Could you be careful with the spoilers? i havent finished the game yet.  :~(
Title: Re: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: Europrick on Jun. 01, 2006, 10:12:30 AM
Oh dear, I'm sorry. A bit of advice: never read anything about a game until you've finished it. Every time I look up something about a game I'm currently playing, I'm always accidentally finding lots of spoilers ruining a lot of the fun.
Title: Re: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: xneoangel on Jun. 01, 2006, 05:01:44 PM
Ok then i'll take your advice, i don't like to read spoilers about a game im playing.  :P

/xneoangel runs away off this thread before he ends up reading a Dawn of Ys or a Mask of The Sun(i also havent finished this one yet) spoiler.
Title: Re: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: ranzor on Jun. 02, 2006, 06:48:07 AM
Seldane, I know that Dawn of Ys isn't the official sequel and that Hudson took many liberties with Falcom's script, still, I like some elements of this better than Mask of the Sun, and it would be nice if Falcom combined some things from it when they do the REAL official version of the game. As far as I know, Tokinhouse developed MotS alone and is not a hundred percent true to Falcom's original script. Anyway, I'm not much for ressurecting dead characters, and I didn't specially like the return of Fact and Sara (but she didn't die in Hudson's version of Ys I and II, so it's not really a ressurection). The thing I liked was the whole story of Arem, Lord Lefance's old enemy. I also liked how they interwined Dark Fact and the Black Pearl with the story of Selceta. As far as I remember, this wasn't in MotS, but it's been a while since I played that game, so I could be wrong. I guess I'll just have to replay it some time.
Title: Re: Vote for your favorite version of Ys IV!
Post by: IinoSama on Apr. 15, 2009, 05:48:33 PM
Lol everyone stop hassling Nightwolve... it's just a poll... and on the thought of polls... GO DAWN OF YS... (I love the Turbografx and all its precursors / demented spawn ofs... hehe)